Ongoing saga re Mum, housing & social care / Too many procedures!/ Extremely worried

That’s awful, and to wait until almost the last minute to make you aware of the issues is disgraceful. I can imagine how very stressful you will all be finding this.

Not got anything helpful to suggest unfortunately :slightly_frowning_face:

It is disgraceful.

We’re just so upset, I get they only want to protect mum. But at the end of the day it’s not really protection if they are adding to the homelessness.

I’m peed off because I had to take the day off from work today at short notice. I’m allowed on the grounds that I just make time back. It’s a small team so there is no one to cover me really. I just don’t do anything that important (I mean I don’t work in an essential service). My job is important to the business.

It just stresses me out, because it takes time out of everything and then my colleagues get affected because they have to pick up slack. Only for it to collapse anyway.

They have essentially told us “you can’t have this, although you need it, because of someone else and it’s not even in our control.”

Back into the system we go for the third time.

@Coolcar98, I would ask them why are properties being offered to your mum but they know what the area is like who is vulnerable? See what answers they come up with.

It’s part of their checks.

The question should be why is a place listed as being sheltered accommodation for those over 55 who are vulnerable and have extra needs and then when you bid are told sorry your needs are just too much. Everyone bidding will be vulnerable.

The thing is mum said she loved the property and when we saw it it was just an instant “yes”.

Mum was hopping around giddily, but there were so many people there today, some didn’t introduce themselves to us.

Then I could sense something there was something not right. I saw one person whisper to another.

Mum has a tendency to get hyperactive so I told her to tone it down. She tends to get over friendly and overfamiliar too, and then reveals abit too much. I’m often worried that she will say something that may just get her in trouble.

Mum asked me why I said it, and I told her because you might not get it.

I knew something wasn’t right. Then it came.

We tried to say to them look we’ve lived on x street for 15 years, there is nothing we haven’t seen and it’s true.

Mum said she would just stay away, if she got it, but they think she is a target.

We say yes to the property, they aren’t so sure. It’s no longer our decision.

The trouble is people are so scared of drugs, that everything else becomes blindsided. I don’t condone the use of drugs, nor will I ever use them myself unless you count the millions I get from the pharmacy.

You can’t go anywhere in my city without someone publicly using. A

But they must have known about the anti-social behaviour before you even visited the property, so what was the point in getting you to go and view it if they were going to turn round and say no it’s not suitable? They are just wasting your time (or going through the motions of being seen to be doing something whilst actually doing very little!). I would be fuming too.

Do you have any final say in the matter, as in “well Mum and I both think this place would be okay, we want to take it.” Surely they have to take both your views into account otherwise what is the point in involving you?

Is there anybody higher up the in authority ladder you can complain to?

Make it clear to them them if they do not rehouse your Mum asap, they will be responsible for the consequences, because you cannot house her.

It’s totally f’d up.

No point complaining tried that before and they have a procedure, they essentially pause everything to investigate the complaint. I wa forced to withdraw last time just to get some more help.

There was also way too many people there today. I’m not afraid of crowds or anything like that (sort of), it was more of a concern because there must have been about 6 people, 8 if you include me and mum.

I was only made aware that three were coming, the OT which we met first-she was lovely. Then the sheltered person. Then someone from the allocations team. That’s what I was told, then suddenly there were three more. No idea who they were or anything, no introduction.

We’re talking to the OT as we were exploring. I peered round a corner and two of the people were in the bedroom whispering. I knew at that point something wasn’t right.

Mum was still being giddy, I couldn’t explain what I saw at that moment. I told her to stop because she might not get the property. Then they told us.

The way they were talking seemed to suggest that they had their mind made up before we got to say our bit.

They said they were at liberty to tell us what is going on and they said it was because they felt like they had a duty to. However, they refused to tell us what was going on. I asked if it was violent crime and they still said they couldn’t say.

We still want the property. Mum lives in her own little world anyway, so it’s going to be different. I doubt she will have the complaints other people have.

They were also gaslighting her a little bit. They kept telling her “I saw what it was like downstairs. You’re too young to be here, it looks like it’s for old people.” Mum is 57 the requirements are 55. She doesn’t mind older people because we believed it would remove the riff raff element and lead her to nicer people.

Or stuff like “you’d be better off in a bungalow.”

Or there are lots of lovely properties around, well where are they then because if they were on the bidding system I would have bloody well bid on them.

I was also not happy with the amount of people there today. I felt like there were too many talking to each other rather than us.

The OT spoke to us the most, we were laughing as we were waiting for everyone else.

My words were it’s a perfect area, mum would really benefit from the communal spaces as they would help her mental health.

The line “we’ve lived at x street for 15 years, we’ve seen it all” was 100 percent true.

What about the bungalow?

@bowlingbun Basically gone to the next person.

Because this and the bungalow came back at the same time we could only progress with one.

We went for the new on the grounds that she was allocated this place which was better suited to her needs. This one was classed as a sheltered place in a complex which is what has been desired for two years. Better location by far, closer to amenities, literally next door to a big Asda. Plus it was bigger, the bungalow looked tiny.

We were also told that all checks came back fine and as long as she passed the affordability she would be green lighted. She passed everything. We had very clear reasoning to pick this one, but then they pulled the wool over our eyes.
.
We were told two weeks ago that the bungalow would not be ready for another 6 weeks, so it was a surprise to get that call.

Just called them to see what was going to happen next and if there was an update. Their response.

“Is it for x property”

Me “yeah”

“Well you’re going to have to wait it’s not going to happen that quickly.”

Me “okay then.”

They didn’t have to be so abrupt with me. Why are these people playing with lives?

They left me absolutely hanging earlier, no information about next steps, no indication of times, no one to discuss anything.

I feel like a decision has been made on our behalf.

Bidding comes available again tomorrow, but she’s still under offer so she can’t bid right now. She’s either suitable or she isn’t.

How are they preventing homelessness if she can’t bid.

These people need their wages reduced until they do their job right and they have a cheek to say they are underpaid. They should step into us carers shoes.

As the person said earlier they wanted to tell us because they had it before where an elderly couple moved in and they became more vulnerable under their watch, they don’t want it to happen to mum.

Whose back are they protecting here, because they didn’t give us a choice, they’ve made their minds up. Sounds like they’ve been in for it. But if they mess up again, I will have their job. They have a duty of care for the people under their care, not themselves. If these people are so bad: why haven’t they been evicted.

Oh yeah, I forgot. Only the decent people get evicted.

I’ve also just spoken to the case worker and she said she was in complete agreement with me about the way these people have handled it.

I explained that right now all we know is these reports could take some time, and yet the most likely outcome is she is unsuitable on vulnerability grounds which have not been made clear.

There has been no discussion on why she could be vulnerable. We sure it’s drugs, but not 100 confirmed. Yet they refuse to disclose this information. Why?

Imagine another situation where the police are involved

“We think you’re in danger?”
“Okay, why?”
“Sorry, cant tell you”
“Why would you think that?”
Sorry, can’t tell you!”
“Well what makes you think I am vulnerable ?”
“We just think you are based on what we know!”
“What do you know?”
“Sorry can’t tell you!”

How stupid does that sound.

Why would mum be considered more vulnerable to drug users other than someone else, say an elderly person in this place. Why is someone doing drugs and becoming a danger not being evicted? Why have they been allowed to be around other vulnerable people for as many months. Where is the duty of care?

Based on this person stating that this problem has been going on a while they knew that this property was abit of a danger and yet they have proceeded knowing mums vulnerabilities, again why?

The senior case worker just told me that they have to do certain things such as a sensitive letting or otherwise which has not been done.

Based on what they said earlier the sheltered person knew that it was an issue, yet instead of saying no, they went ahead. Why?

Why disclose the information, but then not let us say our bit.

You’re telling me you’ve got a home you can’t let out because of something serious, but you won’t remove said person?

Mum is vulnerable to lots of things I agree, however what makes her more vulnerable here. What is it she’s vulnerable to? If it’s drugs, wouldn’t the most able bodied people be vulnerable. Alright there is different levels of vulnerability but my point stands.

Drugs are drugs, they are bad because they hurt everyone.

But why is the housing of someone who had broken the law being better thought of again. Why I’m asking that question I don’t know?

All I know is right now, I just need to know if she’s suitable or not. So we can make the informed decision to proceed.

If this is the case we need to go back into the system as quickly as possible, but if there is a delay then are bids going to open and close again and she could miss out.

It’s crunch time now

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The council are an absolute joke.

Mums section 21 ends tomorrow and she’s extremely upset about it all. Now it becomes a legal issue and someone like her is vulnerable because she doesn’t understand.

The case worker has tried to get an extension. But no word as yet. Landlord hasn’t got back to them.

I’ve just received a call from the OT, and it looks like they are going to decline the offer. I got on with the OT she was the most honest/realistic, the rest sounded like they were trying to hard.

We had a really honest discussion which she said she completely understands and understands why we would be annoyed especially given mums needs.

We have been led down a misguided path. The more I think about it, the more I question why a facility designed for vulnerable older people is so rife with anti social behaviour, someone has seriously stepped back. Who is in this place? Why haven’t they been evicted?

Where is the duty of care towards the current residents.

The OT said they don’t want to let the property out to anybody never mind anyone who is vulnerable. Apparently the anti social behaviour is that bad and has been for 18 months.
The woman said multiple elderly people have absolutely suffered. What is going on?

Why was it put on the bidding system then?

Coolcar, as you know, I’ve followed your posts for a long time.
The more I read the more inept and useless the people you are dealing with appear.
Are they all stupid, or is it just the person in charge?
Surely, BEFORE allocating anywhere, there should be a group meeting of all concerned?
At the end of all this maybe you should use your journalistic skills to highlight the issue, without naming which authority?
I just hope that something suitable comes up with the next round of bidding, is this a weekly process?

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It’s horrific how badly managed the whole situation has been so far :slightly_frowning_face:. It doesn’t help you now, but I agree with Bowlingbun that this should be brought into a more public eye - I bet it’s not the only council area that has major flaws in their housing systems like this. I wonder how much time and money is wasted in total, for each person trying to get a new home? The whole system needs a major overhaul :slightly_frowning_face:.

I really hope the extension comes through to give you a little more time to sort something out for your mum

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It is. It’s what was said at the meeting too, it was like we were being gaslighted. They said to me “don’t worry there are lots of properties across the city like this. Mum also may benefit from a bungalow.” I just laughed and I said “doesn’t mean they will come available though does it.” She said they will see what they can do. Its just a get out clause.

Bidding has just opened. Not a single property anywhere in the city which would meet mums needs. Everything is three bed houses.

Absolutely bloody precisely. Zilch.

It feels like a second kick in the teeth it really does. I didn’t for a second believe them, but it was hoped something would at least be suitable tonight for mums sake not theirs. Yet zilch.

Where are all these amazing properties we were told to believe existed?

The only property on there is listed for the Beverley Road area (no effing way- due to high sex crime, and one case of violent murder recently). The property was listed under an housing association directly and has been on their system for weeks. Apparently no one wants it because it struggles to fit a single bed. (These were the words of the letting agent at the housing association, we spoke to her.) I think they just want to pile off all their crap propreties on unsuspecting people.

Like what’s happening with that place, they don’t care about anti social behaviour for x reasons. They don’t even care that they have a duty of care.

They said they would explore other options, just think the absolute morons (I wanted to say worse) don’t care in the slightest. I asked for means to contact them multiple times and they shrugged me off every time.

There are options but they will not let us have a say. There is the adapted housing list which is the first port of call. Mum is on that list, but they won’t offer her anything on it. We don’t know what properties are on it, only that it’s an exclusive list. This list is above the usual lettings system and properties are allocated to people on this list before they are put on the bidding system.

I know it’s not the end of the world, but now it feels scary. Now It becomes legal. Mum is unable to defend herself in court, and right now I just feel like I’m too exhausted to care meanwhile my head is literally screaming.

They are absolute morons, yet they don’t seem to have any hang ups housing certain types of people. Proprieties are always available to them at the cost of making families homeless. (This is true- people have been paid out of their homes).

Part of me believes that it must be someone within this category who has caused the anti social behaviour, why else are they unable to remove the person? They must be protected for x reason.

Earlier I was driving back from the supermarket this evening. (It’s next door to this place).

Had there been somewhere to stop I would have stopped and asked someone- there was a door open. I don’t mean go in. The doors to people’s homes are on the side I would have approached them.

I question what anti social behaviour can be so bad that it has them scared. This is not light drug use.

I’ve looked into legal proceedings for getting evicted from a council house. It’s harder however if there is substantial evidence then it’s a done deal.

So why hasn’t it been done.

Also housing associations pretty much advertise with the council. Also having seen a couple, they just seem to be awful places full of council rejects.

The one we visited had reports of bed bugs. I’ve been worried since because I keep finding random bite marks on my skin.

I’m just so done. I’m fine but the boxing gloves are getting hung up.

Because she was given a homeless priority based on medical needs, the medical priority creating another Band B has gone.

They are saying that she doesn’t have the medical needs she thinks she has as they believe she can manage a low bath, there wasn’t even an effing bath in the property. Regardless of if she can get in it, or not- she cant get out because she cant bend her knee and put strength on it. I have many records of saying this.

I didn’t mention it but when first meeting the OT said to mum “she didn’t look disabled.”
I didn’t realise I had to strap her mobility scooter on the back of my little 2009 Kia Picanto like a flipping Jet Ski.

I didn’t realise that she is cured now. Should I be hosting a party since my carer role has now stopped. But they told us the other day that she was too vulnerable for a property. Make it make sense.

Also once again mental health capacity has been ignored.

The homeless caseworker has to do a complete reassessment because without the above bandings it’s collapsed. Even then the highest she will get is band B homeless. It sounds good on the surface- but it doesn’t factor in adaptations that has all gone. She’s in the same position as a normal able person, and there will be hundreds if not thousands of these people waiting.

I don’t know if her original application date will stand.

If nothing comes up by the end it’s straight in temp accommodation, it might not be in the city. There is no vulnerability then, she could be with anyone. Frankly it’s too high of a risk and mum will hate it. Temporary accommodation has no rights it’s that or the streets. If she has an issue, no one will care. She’s at the bottom of society.

She is nothing now. They have absolutely well and truly screwed us over. Whilst there is cause for fight, it’s not worth it. These people pat each others backs on the daily.

After knowing they will willingly keep a dangerous person in a vulnerable persons facility it says all I need to know about their response to duty of care.

Mum wants us to seriously fight and complain. It’s all well and good but she won’t be the one doing it.

I’m okay, but I can’t go another round. It’s been like this for two months. I’m not sure I could take another round, and not come out of it okay. I can’t give mum everything she wants.

She’s kicking off because I won’t go straight to the local rag (not who I work for). I’ve told her I don’t think it’s wise, in my professional opinion I don’t think she will get the outcome she wants.

I also personally think it will open the door to a round of abuse from people who don’t understand. Not everyone will agree with mum and I think she’s too irresponsible to accept that nor understand this. Right now something like that would hurt me never mind her.

There is a case for whistleblowing I agree, but a 21 year old recently graduated journalist is not the answer. No offense to the person, I know it’s the companies forcing these stories on people. It’s like likes of reach Plc. (I work for one of the last surviving independents).

The most we will get is 47 year old Sheila telling us how bad the system is.

Right now I also don’t want to burn bridges. Once mum is secure then fine, but right now no.

I’ve called the housing association we’re going to take the one we turned down.

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Sadly, that seems to be the only option left. I’m so sorry it’s come to this. Take care of yourself.

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We sign up on Monday. Can’t help but worry what’s next though.

We are going to start to move her in next Thursday.

We have been told there that there is a lot of financial help available, better than the council.

On sign up mum will be given a £50 voucher for B and Q. Moving costs are also available and discrepancy funds to help pay for the rent initially, also help with white goods.

(She has a fridge already but it will be too big)

I am so done with them at council. They have seriously screwed us over.

Wierdly it seemed like everyone was in on it. After I got the call, I called the case worker straight away and they said they knew what had happened. Was we the last to know.

Was everyone in this meeting?

They were being weird about awarding band A the first time, I don’t believe they wanted her on it, but they had me to deal with and nothing would have got past me.

I feel like we haven’t been listened to in regards to mums disabilities. No mention of mental health vulnerabilities whatsoever. Frankly, I also don’t believe an indepth discussion ever took place regarding mums health issues. There were more people that viewing than we were told about. Too many people trying to do their own thing, too many where we had no idea who they were or what they were doing it’s like we became abit of an exhibit. I recall that we only really spoke to 2 of them the OT and the Sheltered person. We briefly spoke more generally to another person but she just seemed to be as baffled as anyone.

It was hard because I go find it hard to focus on more than one thing at once outside the normal boundaries it sets my OCD going because I don’t have control in a sense.

If I don’t focus, it creates the what iffs. So have all these people around doing stuff did get me abit. Too have people around me doing different things pulling you in one direction then another, it’s hard to keep track. I can multitask fine if it’s normal everyday things, because I know I can stop at anytime or go back if needs be.

Now I wonder if I didn’t do something correctly. But on the other hand I know this is not my fault. They never had any inclination of giving her that property, why that viewing happened I don’t know.

I also know There is something wrong with mum but no one can put their finger on it. Sometimes you can meet someone, even though they are all there, there is something not right about them. With mum it’s probably autism or something. But I think social services forget that there must be a generation of people who have never had the formal diagnosis because people weren’t really aware of it many years ago. Even now people struggle. Back then people did not want neurodivergent children.

My mums siblings aside from one (severely brain damaged since birth) come across quite normal. Normal used loosely, because non of them (except for the oldest) are good people.

The trouble is it’s all to box ticky, they want you to say a word, PTSD, COPD, diabetes, arthritis you name it. But how do you put the words

“Well mum had a very difficult childhood due to being the youngest of five, only for the oldest to have children of her own the same age as my mum making the attention spread further. Only for that attention to be spread thin anyway, buy a horrible violent son and a severely disabled child, and another that’s a baby which is also poorly. (The child (mums niece) died when she was a couple of years old.)

Then there is the fact that mums mum was diagnosed with throat cancer when mum was 15, and mum was forced to give up education as none of the other family members (aside from the disabled one) wanted to know, and she was put in a position caring for the two. Meanwhile their dad was presently absent.

All the while mum always had difficulties with things, but no diagnoses was never sought. Now in adult life mum struggles with things, but because she has two (half) working legs and has capacity she can’t have anything wrong with her. She could try to get a diagnosis but everything is so hard and she doesn’t understand herself, so getting her to explain things that are normal to her, are impossible.

Nowadays because of her limited education she comes across as being abit simple and has lost out on a lot of skills which would be considered normal. Now aged nearly 58, you can’t teach her anything because her mind doesn’t grasp it. I’ve tried.

In a box. Unfortunately it’s too many words.

The fact they think she’s vulnerable speaks volumes. Personally I think some of the reason why she was told that is to do with victim blaming.

At present she has to have a 6 month period of showing that she can better manage her relationships to be considered for extra care again.

She was pushed to the floor by a violent ex-convict and had her arm fractured.

She also had some issues with a ‘friend’ who was pestering her for money for food. Only the money was not used for food. Mum knew this but she was afraid of what would happen if she stopped giving them it. They were an ex neighbour. My youngest sister used to play on the street with her daughters when they were little.

I called safeguarding in both cases. Now they think she was to blame for those relationships and they want her to show good behaviour. It’s been incident free for months.

According to them she had capacity to come away, I think otherwise, I think people who are this far gone will do anything to exploit people and it doesn’t matter what the victim does.

Also as I say it was these individuals, we lived in the same house 15 years incident free. The area is not short of people doing drugs openly, but mum hasn’t gone to them “hi, will you be my friends.”” Everyone who wanted to exploit her, had means and motive,

The regard people have for hidden disabilities is unreal.

I am trying not to be so upset about it and just be very practical, but now it’s late and I’ve stopped for the day, I can’t help but feel so ambivalent.

It’s a feeling of defeat, but relief. I should have felt upset when it happened earlier, I was at first. It was more anger. I was speaking to them and I just had enough. I just said “well thank you very much” and put the phone down.

Why I didn’t break at that moment I don’t know, something in me hatched a plan and we got sorted pretty quickly.

Im not saying we’ve been looking in the wrong area, we had already viewed this property but turned it down the grounds that mum was allocated this one with the council.

I’ve told mum not to burn bridges at this stage. I want to make a complaint now that we have had thought. The damage they have done is unbelievable. The fact that supposed sheltered properties are rife with crime, and the council don’t do anything, it should be brought to light.’

Almost want to do a Baby Reindeer and make a Netflix show about it.

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Hi Coolcar,
Quick answer. As tough times in my caring situation too, though of a different kind.

Well done on getting this far. Focus on positives - your Mum won’t be homeless.

Don’t make the complaint until your Mum has moved in and is settled.

Once she is in her new place; pull back for your own well-being (you have been given lots of advice on all your threads of how to do this).

Unfortunately your Mum won’t change, so it’s up to you to set the boundaries and distance yourself. The only alternative is to carry on as you are!

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Yeah, were trying to get at least one Band B back.

Unfortunately, we have to provide medical evidence. I know mum is disabled and she knows she is. The trouble is I don’t know what they are expecting. NHS records aren’t the tell all records councils and governments seem to think they are.

Mum has asthma and diabetes, and arthritis, they are only treated with medication, so its all I can provide.

I have access to her records and it only lists medication she is on for Diabetes, mental health, asthma and high blood pressure. It mentions that she also gets steroid injections.

We cant even use the OT report now, it has been voided. In their eyes she is not disabled, but the medical report suggests she is.

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Hi again,

Nothing much to add at the moment just kind of wanted to seek some advice.

I Know my mum wants to make a complaint. I also feel like this can’t go unnoticed, however I’m not sure where we stand officially.

Mums methods are a little brash with going to the newspaper, I’ve said to her in my professional opinion, I don’t believe she will get the outcome she wants. I know from experience that all a newspaper can do is just report the story, it won’t change anything.

I know I wouldn’t touch a story like this. People think newspapers have power in this situation- we don’t really. Stuff may come out, but I don’t believe it will happen because of the local paper. I’m not saying it can’t make a story, I’m saying It would take some serious investigative journalism.

I also think mum would be setting herself up for vulnerability. People may support her but on the other hand any mention of council houses and benefits are enough to rough some people up. I don’t think mum could take that abuse. I know I can’t. But I don’t care if people agree with us, I don’t think setting up an angry mob will change anything either.

I’m wondering if it would be worth going down the disability rights route?. Everything collapsed because of the OT worker saying mum is not as disabled as she thought she was.

I don’t believe anything has changed much with mum. Mum is waiting on a knee op, and the OT didn’t know that it’s only offered locally to those over 60. Mum is 57. The only thing that has happened is mum has lost alot of weight helping things a good amount, but not totally. At the end of the day mum still can’t get out of the bath without adaptations, it just so happened that the place had a shower, so she was bummed out because apparently she was told it had a bath too.

I also don’t believe they took into account that mum was abit giddy because she really wanted this place and they led her to believe it was hers, so was in high spirits. The whole getting mum sheltered accommodation thing has been going on years. It doesn’t mean her mental health doesn’t exist.

My sister asked me a question earlier, it had no answer, but she’s right.

Would this have happened for any other property? They only had this meeting because of the property itself, if there were no issues she would have been handed it. It’s on them more than us.

I myself don’t know what the outcome will be. I don’t know what I want it to be, but I don’t want to leave it.

I’m just wondering if I am being too hasty or if I have an argument here. I’ve been thinking about going to scope for advice.

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