My husband is 87 and denies that I am his carer in any sense. I do all household chores, help him with putting on fleeces, jackets etc, reach for things he can’t get, wash his hair, carry things … it might not sound much but he would struggle without me. He shows very little initiative.
And he argues! He contradicts so much of what I say. Last night I gently pointed out that he’d pulled a curtain too far (again) and it got stuck. All I asked was to be careful. But I was accused of lying, exaggerating, getting hysterical, needing counselling myself …
I ended up “sleeping” on the floor downstairs, and it was freezing even with blankets.
Yet everyone thinks he’s an amazing old gentleman. I am absolutely exhausted and feeling so low. A housekeeper would be treated better. What do you do when it seems like someone has oppositional defiance disorder?
There is ONE good thing. I think I have now fixed the curtain so he cannot pull it too far. (I’m 5 foot tall and had to go up a high stepladder - but he can’t use it at all, so he can’t meddle!)
@HelpBehindTheScenes Can only send cyber hugs. My husband would argue with his own shadow and is 85 so I totally sympathize. No advice as such but I am working VERY hard on disengaging. My husband says he does not need a Carer either but he is mega deaf cannot operate the dishwasher and burns pans when cooking and leaves the ring on. I run his bath simply because he had a habit of putting it on then forgetting about it. He also struggles online and I do not think he could do an online grocery shop. I deal with all the housework and paying bills too.
For years I think friends thought I was maybe over reacting as he was not too bad when out but horrible to me. I think for him it was realising that he was losing ‘control’. But last 2 or 3 years he has public outbursts.Do you have friends who you can chat too? Maybe a local ‘Support for Carers’? You could phone them and they will offer a listening ear.
I can only suggest you make some kind of life outside of the home. My husband is not social and spends all time attached to the tv via headphones. He thinks ‘wives should not go out without husbands’ but frankly if I did not have some kind of social life I would sink into clinical depression. Would something like a Book Club be of interest? I have made some very good friends over the years chairing it. Husband has to come though which does not really help. You have to work on making a life for YOU and finding things that you enjoy.
@HelpBehindTheScenes Welcome to the forum, and welcome to a club that no one would choose to be a member of… the Unappreciated Carers Club. You are right, a housekeeper would be treated better, at least they get paid, and if they weren’t, they have the option of leaving the job!
I’m in a similar position, caring for my husband who is 14 years older than me. I do virtually everything for him, and around the house despite having my own health issues; yet he says that I could not manage without him!
They are in complete denial. Do you have the support of any other family or friends?
As @selinakylie has already said, you need to do whatever you can to get some kind of life outside of caring. Otherwise it just grinds you down and spits you out.
@HelpBehindTheScenes @EEG m At least if we were housekeepers we would get time off and holidays and not have to be available 24/7. Just hope I can outlive husband!!!
@HelpBehindTheScenes I was drawn to your post by its title, as I care for my mother who also has (amongst other things) oppositional defiance disorder. I have been told it’s a survival reflex from her Adverse Childhood Experiences, which may be the case, but for those around her it’s nigh on impossible to deal with. Today we had an argument about whether Christmas Day was this week or the week after; silly I know, but it literally sucks the life out of me trying to prove that I am right.
I learnt as a teenager (before we knew what ODD was) that there is literally no point in arguing and trying to show mum she is wrong about so many things. My own coping mechanism I suppose. I tried for a while asking her to do the exact opposite of what I wanted her to do; she won’t use her hearing aids for example, so I told her not to wear them any more and then found her wearing them. My children find it hilarious, but it’s exhausting….
I am worried about you sleeping on the floor last night. Try if you can to let the arguing wash over you like a wave, safe in the knowledge that you are trying your best, your best will never ever be good enough and you will never ever win. As others have suggested building a life for yourself is vital and spending time in the company of others allows a different perspective on life. I send 
hugs and support. We are always here if you need us.
Crikey, never knew there was such a thing as Oppositional Defiance Disorder. You learn something every day!
That first paragraph - yes, that’s exactly it. A succession of trivial arguments.
The morning after we married, 1987, I remember he said we hadn’t got a flat tyre. Until I asked why it looked folded! Later, his aunt bought a waistcoat and skirt for our son - clearly accidentally - and my husband said, if she said it was trousers then it was trousers, and our son must wear them! (No, he didn’t!) So the arguing black is white goes back a long way, it’s not just an old age thing. I didn’t know there could be a childhood link - that’s interesting.
It’s amazing what you find when you are looking for answers!
Have to say I have never heard of it either. I had wondered if husband was a high functioning autistic or ‘on the spectrum’ and several friends say he is narcissistic. The lack of empathy worries me.
Just googled and yes the traits listed sound like my husband. Especially arguing with authority figures like medical professionals and being so medically non compliant. It says it is more common in children but we call my husband ‘The Senile Toddler’ that is one of the more ‘polite’ names he has been given by the Book Club.
@HelpBehindTheScenes @selinakylie, I have been living with my Mum’s ODD for sixty years, around 40 as an adult who tried so hard to understand the link to her childhood trauma. If you look up the examples of ACE’s, mum endured most of them as a child. So the ODD develops as a sort of control if you like. If you control every situation then nothing bad will happen to you, and the need to maintain control becomes all consuming. My sister and I were controlled in every way as children (my sister broke in the end and was sectioned with psychosis), whereas I fought back and tried to understand why she does what she does.
I don’t know if understanding WHY will help you both. An argument broke out today, for example, because I had had a Christmas card from an old family friend who told me that she had lost her brother - David - a few weeks ago. I told mum that Barbara’s brother David had recently died and Mum said, “no, Barbara’s brother was called Ian”. She was insistent and we went back and forth until I produced the card, on which was written “my brother David passed away”. Mum then left the room in a huff. This is NOT dementia, it is a need to control the narrative and produces the chronically argumentative person you describe.
Hope that helps 
ODD and narcissistic personality disorder can go hand in hand. My mum has both, along with Obsessive Compulsive Personality Disorder. - which is different to OCD. Yes, I have done a lot of research over the years.
‘Geriatric toddler’ is my term. Are you my twin?!!
What troubles me, is - if someone has ODD and/or autism, does that mean they aren’t exerting coercive control because they can’t help it???
Yes indeed, I can see you have researched a lot. Understanding helps, I find, even if it doesn’t help change much.
That’s an interesting question and probably beyond my level of understanding. Is it coercive control if someone can’t help but be controlling? You could apply that question to so many other personality traits and disorders. I wonder if anyone on here has thoughts on this……
Have had my head in a text book all evening! Apparently some individuals who are coercive controllers also have narcissistic personality disorders and traits.
These individuals have an inflated sense of their own importance. Their inflated sense of self-esteem leads them to believe that they are more important than they are; consequently, they develop fantasies of power, wealth and omnipotence. They see themselves as superior beings and their arrogant sense of entitlement leads them to think that they are above the normal rules of society, and therefore deserving of special treatment. To support their fragile ego, their lack of empathy for others and their sense of entitlement allows them to act out their callous behaviours and exploit their victims. Wow……
it all fits, certainly in my case!
@HelpBehindTheScenes I do not like the way that so many conditions are now treated as if it is ‘not the sufferers fault’ IE Dementia. No concern or thought is given to how WE are expected to cope. I think my husband was always a ‘strong character’ and he had a very difficult relationship with his mother who was much younger than his father. I also think that there were red flags as in
At 51 when we met, I was his third wife 4th if we count one he lived with for 5 years. Also he said his 2 ex wives were ‘mad’ and also another girlfriend. One ex wife developed a drinking issue.
I initially found it flattering when he said’ I only want ONE special person in my life - we do not need friends’. It sort of worked when we had the businesses as we had a fair bit of money and were mega busy but when we retired and after the financial crash of 2008 I realised how lonely I was.
Also he made me choose between him and my mother. I had to choose him as I lived in the apartment that belonged to him.
He constantly told me that no one would believe the abuse and threats as he was educated and I was a ‘nothing’ . I have 2 very good A levels taken in the eighties at evening classes including a grade A but apparently Sociology is not a ‘proper’ A level. I also did a lot of media work including TV and radio and was able to cope with broadsheet journalists.
I do not see any point in making excuses or trying to find a ‘label’ for his condition although would like a dementia diagnosis. I think he is a vicious nasty old man who is frightened and ‘losing control’ of ‘Little Drudge’. The years of mental abuse, gaslighting and threats to my beloved cats as in ‘you have to leave me your number as one of the cats might get hurt and you would want to know’. Cats all indoors. I will never be articulate enough to express what is now Ice Cold Hatred. I think
‘men of a certain age’ and I would include Weinstein Epstien Al Fahid and background think they are ‘entitled’ and this comes through very much with my husband. He really thinks he is so much cleverer than anyone.
I know my views differ from yours on this and in some ways it is easier to say ‘it is the illness’ but to a degree, we need to take responsibilities for our actions? I do sound hard but having coped with him drinking up to a litre of vodka a day I am not as sympathetic on ‘illnesses’ or ‘addictions’ as maybe I should be.
@JayneyT You are spot on . I totally agree E definitely shows signs of narcissistic personality traits! They seem to have got worse as he has got older and maybe lost some of his intellectual sophistry? I am sorry you see these in your mother too. It may be partially a generation thing? Men of a certain social class feel ‘entitled’? Several friends have said this about E over last few years and send me links to articles. But yes it is all about Control and Gaslighting is particularly hard when coupled with isolation as I really did think I was losing my mind at one stage and that NO ONE would believe me over him.
I can see where you’re coming from - you’ve been through hell most of us can only imagine. I completely understand and I don’t think you’re being harsh. Is your GP sympathetic? (You can write to them, if you can’t easily get to an initial appointment.)
My situation is a bit different because although he says he’s proud of my qualifications, in some respects he resents that I had a career and he didn’t really. He can bully and gaslight me, but the one thing he can’t do is condescend. I think it adds to his insecurity.