Select Committee on Work and Pensions Fourth Report 2008 : OUR BIBLE , Also Our Jailer ! Time For A Jailbreak?

**Probably the most important document EVER in our history.

Not an easy or short read , but ESSENTIAL for any reader to understand our situation.

Everything you ever wanted to know about us … as seen by the Government … is in there.**

Terms of Reference


1 Introduction

The Government’s policy on carers

The inquiry

Carers in Britain: who are they?

Carers - definition

Carers by age

Carers by employment status

Diversity among carers

Key public policy issues

Demographic change

Recognising and responding to carers

Diversity of circumstances

Tackling the social exclusion carers face

Opportunity penalties: confidence, skills and employment

DWP’s approach to carers

2 Information, advice and guidance
Quality of DWP services

Benefit Enquiry Line, leaflets, Directgov

DWP advice staff

Merger of the Pension Service and the Disability and Carers Service


Working with other agencies

Welfare benefits advice and healthcare

“Information prescriptions”

National telephone helpline

Carers’ Centres

3 Carers’ income and benefits
Impact of caring on earnings income

Cost of disability and caring

Carers’ benefits

The history and design of Carer’s Allowance

Carer’s Allowance - amount

Carer’s Allowance - underlying entitlements

Take-up of DLA

One CA claim to one DLA/AA claim

Qualifying periods

De-linking carers’ and disability benefits: certification scheme for carers

Carer’s Allowance - overlapping entitlements

Impact of overlapping entitlements on Carer’s Allowance

Impact of the Carer’s Allowance on the person being cared for

Carer’s Allowance: incentives to work, study and volunteer

21 hour study rule

Carer’s Allowance - earnings limit

Carer’s allowance - earnings limit (means-tested benefits)

Barriers to carers’ engagement, volunteering and employment

Passive benefit

Replacing Carer’s Allowance

Proposal for a two-tiered benefit

Concession cards

Impact of caring responsibilities on pensions

State Pension

Personal Accounts

4 Support for caring
Access to information about social care and services for carers

Access to social care support

Social care funding

Support for balancing caring and employment

Employers’ support for caring

Family future planning for care

5 Employment and training strategy for carers

Impact of caring on employment of carers

Impact of caring on former carers’ employability

The Government’s employment strategy

IB/ESA: impact on carers

Flexible working

Lack of awareness

Fear of rejection

Type of flexible working arrangements

Proposals to extend right to request flexible working

Jobcentre Plus support for flexible working

Jobcentre Plus support for self-employment

Time off and Statutory Care Pay

Financial incentives

Working Tax Credit for carers (at 16 hours)

Working Tax Credit and caring (child care costs)

6 Equality, recognition and discrimination

Formal recognition of carers

The role of equality law

Single Equality Act

Human Rights

Conclusions and recommendations

Annex A Committee Visit Notes
Note of the Committee visit to Australia


Government provision for carers

The Policy Challenge: carers and workforce participation

The South Australian model

Carers’ stories

Annex B: Background statistics on carers

Formal Minutes


List of written evidence

**I cannot emphasis too much as to it’s importance.

It’s almost a dna blueprint.

Forthcoming Green Paper / Carers Strategy … much of what will be in it has it’s origin in this Report.

So many questions arise … it’s for the Class of 2019 to find their own answers to them.

Time for that genetic engineer to modify our dna ???**

Thanks for sharing this Chris v useful.

Intend using bit on Jobcentre being pro-active in dealing with employers when have my (self-requested!) conversation next week. B)

It’s a shame that 7.8 million hard copies cannot be made available to each one of us … it is that important.

Trouble is … how many would even open it and starting reading ?

Perhaps a thousand … 1 in 7,800 … ???

THAT’S the real issue … awareness amongst the carer army of 2019 !

For us , it is OUR BIBLE … according to the Government !!!

I’ve just had a quick flick through. Whoever wrote this needs further training, whoever proof read it needs shooting!

Look at the two charts, comparing males to females. The colours differ on the charts!!!

Now the government have finally said that there are more women than men as carers. Will this lead CUK to challenge some of the DWP rules on the grounds of Equality now??

An encyclopedia of a new discovered tribe … the DWP call carers , BB … I’m sure that it is easier
to read that way than imagining it descibes us , and our role in the great scheme of things ?

You never know … we might be granted citizenship one day … and have rights just like everyone else ?

Recent JUGGLING thread … Carers UK response to said committee … recent report … anything changed ?

One for you especially … 2004 members resolution on level of Carers Allowance … section in the Report … Fairer
for Carers debacle last year … seems CUK don’t read their own previous submissions ???

I like charts, BUT I can’t see the point of using dark green for men in one chart, then for women in the next chart. It would have been easier if they’d at least been consistent for both charts. Maybe Blue for Boys and Pink for Girls would have been easier still?
How many people even referred to the colour key in the second chart I wonder???

Interesting observation.

11 years on and … political correctness maybe … no more blue / pink maybe in case it upsets the third gender ?

There again , what was the chart creator smoking at the time ?

Like said report , so many questions … so few answers … and , even then , answers that make sense ?

We really do come across as a separate race inside society.

Said uniqueness strongly argued by CarerWatch at that time which , if accepted , would have led to the ultimate goal
of a Carers Charter , enshrined in law.

2019 … we haven’t a clue as to what’s really going on before we are presented with our fate … the Green Paper.


Invitations have been sent out for " Observers " to attend a meeting of the All Party Carers Group where David Mowat mp , Minister for Community Health and Care , will present proposals for the forthcoming Government strategy for carers.

1pm - 2pm on the 15th March 2017


CUK … March 2017 …A few members of our Policy and Public Affairs Team attended the APPG meeting on carers in Parliament yesterday. Minutes are currently been written up and I’ll post the key points here when they become available.

Green Paper Carers Strategy thread … we still await those " Key points " … albeit we have some from an independent source.

OUR future … nobody elses … don’t we have a right to know ???

How times change … for the worst !

How do we get a paper copy of this?
Once we get the answer, I suggest every single one of us asks for a copy!

I read what I thought was the document quickly, and then when I went back to it, realised it was just the start, there were a succession of arrows at the bottom saying “Next” I’d completely missed! I blame my cold, well that’s my excuse, and I’m sticking to it.

Yep … it’s MASSIVE … chapter , verse and a whole kitchen full of sinks !

It literally is THE definite document … akin to a small telephone directory.

Hard copy ?

I’ll investigate and report back.

Best guess ?

£ 25+ … I have some sources for specialist reports … mainly old DTI ones.

That didn’t take long !

Internet only … unless a brave reader wants to print one off … a lot of paper !

Then … photopies for how many … postage ?

Fit through one’s letter box ?

Make a good door stop at the very least !

There again , think of the trees that were sacrificed !

Well it SHOULD be available printed, for any carer.
I have a high speed laser printer, and wear glasses. I printed off the first few pages, then realised that lots of it when printed is in a Font size of about 6. Far too small.
I especially wanted to see if Direct Payments were mentioned, went to the Index, the link isn’t working!!
So clearly they were hoping we wouldn’t be able to read or use it properly?!?!

Direct Payments ?

Still in the embryo stage at that time … GREEN PAPER Carers Strategy thread contains a first hand account of discussions
with the DWP on the proposed rollout and a briefing paper from CarerWatch ( DPs given the treatment ) :

PAGES 3 + 9 :

( Note … all CarerWatch at that time … nothing from either CUK nor Carers Trust. )

Best history recap on the Internet :

Direct Payments Campaign in the U.K. | Independent Living Institute

For a real heavyweight analysis of DPs , the following is the bible :

27 pages worth in .pdf format.

Interesting … barely a murmur from the forum.

The one definitive document that explains fully why 7.8 million of you are in such dire straits.

Oh well , I can only do so much.

Time to get this one back into the frame.

After all , it is the MOST IMPORTANT report ever produced in our history.

A sticky perhaps … after the 4th. time of asking ???

**A nudge for a sticky ?


I went to a recent event in London, which was addressed by the latest CEO of Carers UK. Her focus was entirely on getting carers “back to work”. Cosying up to DWP.
I was infuriated beyond words. There are many of us unable to work at all. What about us? I may be over 65, so I get the pension. I don’t get ANYTHING for the caring I provide. Personally, I think carers over 65 should get CA and the pension as well. We may qualify for the “retirement” pension but are certainly not retired. I recently did a straight 168 hour week so my son could do something he wanted to do, that wasn’t possible with his “providers”.


Her focus was entirely on getting carers “back to work”.

One has to wonder just what CUK’s priorities are ???

Supporting OUR needs or keeping us under control … to be seen but … definitely NOT heard ?

Since 2009 , not even a even odds bet !

One of CUK’s trustees posted on the forum recently … brave lass ?

What does she and her cohorts make of all this ???

Just how are we members being heard by the CUK of 2019 ???

What’s the point of having members in the first place ???

9th. request … please make this thread a sticky !!!

What does she mean by that? I wonder how she is going to achieve that. I agree with her but she needs to be more practical. All carers should have access to education and training opportunities that basically enable them to have their own life.
I work full time outside the home as a self employed childcare provider. It is what I love doing. And it keeps me fit and sane too. My life is not just about his medical appointments, therapy sessions etc.

A New Year’s resolution ?

Hardly … just to get this thread back into the forefront of ANY decision making this year.